It’s the same chair !!!! OMFG !!

This post was written by marc on May 13, 2004
Posted Under: Bush,Politics

Here’s where you really need the tin foil hat. Look at this pic that was released today of the latest prisoner abuse at Abu Ghraib prison. Notice the white chair in the lower left corner. Now – look at the chair Nicholas Berg is sitting in!! It’s the same fucking chair!!

I have some more pics but the walls are the same yellow color and the baseboard is the same color as Abu Ghraib prison. Then – as I’ve said before – what is Nicholas Berg doing in an orange prison jump suit? The orange jump suit is the same color as the ones used at the prison!!! Terrorists don’t put the people they kidnap in orange prison jump suits!

Now – put that together with the fact that these “terrorists” are WHITE and FAT and they are wearing BULLET PROOF VESTS!! So who goes around wearing bullet proof vests all the time? People like CIA – Prison guards!

This is enough to scare the shit out of you but – Nicholas Berg was murdered by AMERICANS at Abu Ghraib prison. They staged it so as to make it look like terrorists murdered Berg.

If you have a different opinion then you tell me why they have the same plastic furniture – the same walls – the same floorboard color – and the same orange jump suit. You tell me why these terrorists are fat white guys wearing bullet proof vests. You tell me why they speak bad Arabic. You tell me why they yell like Americans when they kill Berg. I suppose the terrorist picked up those chairs at the local WalMart!

There is a dispute as to if Berg was in US custody. He was arrested by Iraqi police but they claim they turned him over to American custody. America however denies that they had him.

CNN said initially that they were sure the voice was NOT al-Zarqawi. The CIA however confirms that it is. Isn’t that amazing! I listen to the voices and it doesn’t sound like the voices of someone who speaks Arabic as their first language.

But you see – it’s not about the voices that make you think it’s not al-Zarqawi. In May 2002 Zarqawi traveled to Iraq. He had his leg amputated and had a prosthetic limb to replace it. So – for a guy with ONE LEG al-Zarqawi is VERY NIMBLE on his feet! So – make you wonder how well the CIA thought things through when they decided to play terrorist?


This is what a REAL terrorists look like. This is the picture of Daniel Pearl who was also killed by terrorists. Notice the thin brown hands – the grabbing of the hair – and the gun to the head. The guy is mean – angry. Pearl has on ordinary clothes and his hands are chained. When you look at the picture you can feel the wildness of a true terrorist. You can tell Pearl looks like he knows he is in big trouble. The clothes on the terrorists look normal for the region – but on the photos of the Berg terrorists – they look like they are in a costume.


Now look at the Berg terrorists. These guys look like the 5 stooges! They are FAT and WHITE. Check out the guy on the right. Do I see WHITE SHOES? Wonder how he keeps them clean running around the Iraqi desert?

When he reads the statement – does he sound angry? I don’t hear it. He’s reading a script.

As to can see on terrorists 2, 4, and 5 – the BULLET PROOF VESTS. American MPs wear them all the time. To them it’s like putting on their underwear. hey wear them so that if a prisoner tries to make a knife and stab them in the heart – they are protected. I guess they never thought they would show up under the terrorist costume.

Berg has no idea what it about to happen. He looks comfortable – perhaps to comfortable. I think they probably told him that they wanted him to pretend to be a hostage in order to get out of prison. Berg knew he was back at Abu Ghraib prison and that his “captors” were Americans – and that he was playing a role. Notice the orange prison garb in the picture.

The beheading changed the mood of the nation. Several lawmakers commented that after the beheading that it reminded them what the real issues were. So the beheading had the intended effect – that is – to inflame Americans and get them to think that torture is something that can be acceptable.

What we are seeing here people scares me beyond belief. I sit here stunned. I want to call someone but don’t know who to call. If this turns out to be true – the world will experience a moment of horror unlike anything the world has ever experienced – except maybe the nuking of Japan.

WHAT YOU NEED TO DO: What I’ve posted here isn’t an absolute conclusion but asks a lot of questions that need to be answered. I need you to get everyone possible to link to this web page – or – copy it and post it on other sites. I need you to call your members in the US House and Senate. I need you to call your local radio and TV stations and get them to look at this.

Even though exposing this is bad for America – what is really bad for America is if we do this and get away with it. We can not allow America to become like NAZIs. The integrity of who we are and what we believe in must be preserved. We are a people of TRUTH and the only thing that’s important is to find out WHAT REALLY HAPPENED HERE.

More strange stuff:
The link below is a Canadian Broadcasting Corporation (CBC) documentary called Convoy of Death documenting the slaughter of 3000 Afgan POWs in December of 2001.
Afgan POWs Killed – 55mb Quicktime Format

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I’ve closed the comments on this. There are already too many comments and just about everything that can be said has been said dozens of times.

Addressing other issues and comments

A lot of you have left comments about what I wrote that should be addressed. There are many who agree – many who disagree – and many who are confounded. Some people have posted other reasons to support or not support my assessment. I’m not going to address everything – but try to hit the main points.

First – I tried to stick with what I though was the most solid questions abut the beheading. There are other less solid ones – but I wanted to be focused.

Then – one of my goals is to raise these questions so that they get answered. There may be a reason that the terrorists dressed Berg in the same garb used in the prison. There may be reasons for everything I raised. I want to hear those things explained. I want to hear the questions asked – if nothing else – but to give satisfaction to those who disagree with me to gloat. Let’s ask the questions and get the answers.

Yes – every single item taken by itself can be explained as an amazing coincidence. But when you out it all together – it crosses the line into something else. It’s like if you tell me you once won the state lottery I’d say – wow – you must be very lucky. But then you tell me you won the lottery twice and I say – “er – really?” Then you say – I won the lottery 5 times in a row ….. Now you’re lying – even though each single instance is barely believable.

In this case we have the same situation. The prison garb – maybe. The chair – maybe. The two legs instead of one – maybe. They were all white and fat – maybe. But – put it all together – I’m not buying it.

Furthermore – for those of you who haven’t made the leap to the conclusion I came to – that Americans dressed as terrorists did it – you at least have to admit that serious questions are raised that need to be answered. And I’m hoping you all will help me get the questions asked.

  • No Blood – I only watched it once but it was a blur to me. There may be a reason that there is blood (has to be blood) but we don’t see it. The reality is – Berg really is dead – and his head really was cut off. So – whatever doesn’t make sense about the blood is just generally confusing.
  • The Gold Ring I’m told this is against Islamic law. And – that contributes to the argument. I personally don’t find it persuasive by itself, but it contributes a little.
  • The Tape was Edited – Yes – there are wo time lines on the tape. What does that mean? Does it mean it was faked? Again – Nick Berg is really dead. So – I believe he was actually killed by the guys on the tape. But – what it does indicate is that the terrorists have what seems to be two cameras and digitial video editing equipment. Other tapes from bin Laden are not as high tech. Generally a physical copy is delivered to a TV station rather than a two camera production that is digitally edited and uploaded to a web site.
  • Why cover his face and then give his name? – Yes – this is a good point. That is what you would do if you weren’t who you say you are. And it’s one of those add on reasons that supports my conclusion.
  • Political Timing and Motives – I’ve avoided this because I don’t want to get distracted by a political debate. That debate is there – but I’m trying to focus on the facts that are not in dispute. I draw my information from the published pictures. Motive do need to be considered – but I’m not going there in this article.
  • The CIA couldn’t be that stupid – Yes – they can. This murder looks like the kind of short term bad thinking that the Bush administration is known for. The prison sex abuse pics we are seeing shows that – yes – they really can be that stupid.
  • Orange Prison Garb – This is what I consider the strongest red flag that he was at the prison. Americans put prosiners in orange so that if they escape they are easier to spot. The last thing a kidnapper is going to do is put a hostage in orange. Orange is what you put on people who you want to attract attention to.

    Berg was in custody of the US. Something the US is still lying about. So – when he was released do you think they are going to send him out on the streets of Iraq wearing orange? Not hardly! Orange means pick this guy up and bring him back to prison. They would have taken the prison garb away and gave him his clothes back.

    Even if for some reason he got out with prison grab on – the first thing he would have done is get regular clothes. You just would not walk around Iraq wearing orange.

    So – then if he’s abducted again by terrorists – and lets say that they somehow had clothing just like the prison garb – are they going to put him in it? Not hardly. If you are a terrorist kidnapper the last thing you want to do is draw attention your way. So – orange prison outfit – no way!

Reader Comments

You are obviously not very good at noticing things or you would have noticed that I said, “supposedly.” I simply shared the link to allow you to make up your own mind. You obviously didn’t even look at it, which speaks volumes in itself.

#1 
Written By Soseraphic on May 17th, 2004 @ 9:26 pm

Why are you calling me an anti-semite, I was only asking a question.
Inform me anyway, I want to know. I bet you’ll tell me something about the distinguishable nose.
It’s well known that over 90% of todays so called Jews are the descendents of the Khazars from the Caucasus mountains. This is the empire that decided to convert to Judaism hundreds of years ago, which means these are Jews by religion, not by blood so they are not true semites.
These are the same people that ever so conveniently decided to leave themselves out of the history books, the same ones that today accuse people of being anti-semites whenever their agenda is in any way revealed.

#2 
Written By Alxandro on May 17th, 2004 @ 9:31 pm

I consider myself an independent that leans to the right. As far as Bergs death. Yeah I think he was already dead before the video, it was a fabrication.

I also think maybe the jumpsuit was used, because the military tends to tape interrogations, and they had a tape of Mr. Berg from his previous interrogation in Mosul. To merge existing video with the beheading, they would need to keep him in an orange jumpsuit.

Just like terrorsits killed in Fallujah with Iraqi Police ID’s, a percentage of the Iraqi’s working with US forces leave their day job and plot terrorist activity. Maybe the abductors were tipped off by Iraqi’s in the prison. From Bergs emails I’ve read on the web, he was moved from a cell block because the Muslim prisoners resented being held with a Jew.

As far as him making it back to Bagdad, maybe his killers couldn’t get to him before he left Mosul, or wanted to make sure American forces wern’t tailing him before they kidnapped him.

I really don’t think US forces killed the man. If the US found his body they already knew his father was filing suit over his detainment. There would be a lot less controversy if there was video that terrorists killed him rather than him just turning up dead. Plus if it gained sympathy for the cause over there.. bonus.

One thing to remember is that these terrorists want you dead and don’t care if you’re a Republican or Democrat. If you’ve read any of their manifestos, they want to rid the world of western culture and “infidels.” Radical islam sent Afghanistan and Iran back into the “stone age.” And extemists tried previously to hit the World Trade Center in the Clinton Admin. so I don’t buy the claim “Bush Knew.”

We are no angels and the prison abuse scandal is inexcusable, but what have we gained over there? We are the most resistant to the UN so all the New World Order theories are out the window if you ask me. (And I’ve heard them all….. living in Montana with all the patriot extremists waiting for the day they can dig up all their guns they’ve buried in their back yards!)

For Money? The Bush Administration is investigating and revoked some of Hailburton’s contracts. The instability of the region doesn’t make for a profitable environment. (Ask Nick Berg, he didn’t land contracts while there. He was giving estimates.) We are forking out a lot more than we are profiting. And we certainly aren’t getting a break on oil.

We need to take responsibility for our foreign policy yes, but there are a lot of other bad govts., regimes and groups out there that are just as guilty. It’s a bad world out there and lets keep things in perspective.

Yes, we are the most hated country on the planet. Partly because we are basically the last superpower left. My kids asked “Mom, why does everyone hate us?” I told them “Why do you hate the NY Yankees? Because they win all the time and have all the money for better players right? Well basically that’s why the world hates us.” We still give more aid and money to every country and cause out there. An tho not perfect, we are an inheritantly good people.

We certainly aren’t going to find a peacful resolution by preaching tolerance to terrorism. Neville Chamberlain thought tolerance would keep Hitler at bay, and England’s failure to take a pro-active stance almost caused them to lose the war.

Japan and Germany had occupation for years befoe they stabilized. We still have forces in Bosnia (Clinton Admin.) If we pull out now Iraq will have more civil war than they do now. If we stay we are the occupation. We can’t win.

Bush blew it because he didn’t take into consideration that given a choice of who the Arabs hate more Hussein, radical islam or the US, they hate the US the most.

#3 
Written By Sharon on May 17th, 2004 @ 9:32 pm

wait.. I think perhaps we had a crosslink… I posted about the same time you did… and then read yours and then mine again… it sounded like I was attacking you. I wasn’t. Not my style. Wasn’t even the case. Don’t take it that way. 🙂 Talk about deception at work! look how easy that was to twist shit up and make it LOOK like I just jumped all over it! Anyway, I was going to say, “good catch!” I’ll look at it.

#4 
Written By tangledwebweaver on May 17th, 2004 @ 9:32 pm

Double posting… talk about paranoid. 😉 Whoever said we wanted to ‘win’? Don’t you think we KNEW this would be a never ending battle- talk about a real money maker(for some). Did we REALLY think that by taking out a couple head people would STOP terror in a World FULL of it!? That would be like saying, let’s bust these two Cocaine makers, and we’ll have won the war on drugs. C’mon, so long as there are people with evil thoughts, there will be terror(ists). We’ll never win the “War on Terror” so long as we’re terrorist ourselves.

#5 
Written By tangledwebweaver on May 17th, 2004 @ 9:49 pm

Sharon – I am an independent that leans to the right as well and I agree with you about everything you’ve stated, except for the part about the US being most resistant to the UN.
Going against the UN was just part of the plan.
Don’t you see, it’s all a freekin’ puppet show, it’s all staged just like WWF match.
Now we hear that the UN will be involved, afterall, with the reconstruction of Iraq.

nichevo – don’t be so paranoid, your posts are still there.

#6 
Written By Alxandro on May 17th, 2004 @ 9:52 pm

hmmm, or maybe not

#7 
Written By Alxandro on May 17th, 2004 @ 9:59 pm

or maybe not… haha… that’s what I said.

#8 
Written By tangledwebweaver on May 17th, 2004 @ 10:01 pm

Tangle, sorry for the accusation. I realized after reading previous posts and the timeframe that you may not have been referring to me. the video shows what looks like a green cap. Can’t tell if it is really army or was even included in the original tape but it is interesting.

#9 
Written By soseraphic on May 17th, 2004 @ 10:02 pm

OMFG, that was freaky

#10 
Written By Alxandro on May 17th, 2004 @ 10:03 pm

Well, for one thing. You guys bitch and bitch about the stuff that might not be used as an evidence. But you never say anything against the hard evidence. CNN and CIA are not saying the same. And why would be anyone who identifies himself wear a mask. If you can explain that you won a battle but not the war. Not here, not against terrorism…

#11 
Written By don Pierre on May 17th, 2004 @ 10:12 pm

No worries. I’m all about unveiling any and all things truthful. Not here to judge. I appreciate your response, but you don’t need to apologize- only learn from our own errs. 😉 There are NO coincidences in life. Things happen for a reason.

#12 
Written By tangledwebweaver on May 17th, 2004 @ 10:17 pm

For those who have the video, turn up the volume and go to 13:46:11 and tell me if you hear someone say “hold him” in between shouts of “Allahu Akbar”. Rewind it a few times, its very distinct from the other sounds once you hear it the first time. He says something afterwards but I can’t make it out.

#13 
Written By Ignoble on May 17th, 2004 @ 10:22 pm

The War on Terror is a joke and just a front for the NWO to push their agenda.
Oh my God, please save us from these Problem, Reaction, Solutions.

Look at the previous wars,
War on Illiteracy – the educational system keeps getting dumbed down, and the bar lowered every year.

War on Drugs – ha
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/2814861.stm

#14 
Written By Alxandro on May 17th, 2004 @ 10:27 pm

BERG MET WITH SHADY IRAQI

Berg teamed up in Baghdad with an ex-Philadelphia man who led a controversial group of Iraqi expatriates encouraged by the U.S. government – even as he faced deportation for his role in Russian-emigre crime ring selling millions of vials used for crack.

Berg was picked because
– unescorted American
– carrying a copy of the Koran

He was robbed once in the streets of Baghdad

Berg and Aziz K. Aziz spent an hour climbing tall buildings at Abu Ghraib…to re-recorded measurements that were in his stolen notebook.

http://www.philly.com/mld/dailynews/news/local/8684646.htm?ERIGHTS=-9086222262578030485philly::buzzflash@buzzflash.com&KRD_RM=7nvvunnuovwnouwnqvnnnnnnnn|mark|N

#15 
Written By trap on May 17th, 2004 @ 10:40 pm

Unfortunately, it takes a great tragedy before we (the majority) will come together in unity and back something (War on Terror). Man, we jumped all over that one! We can’t blame Bush, shoot, we voted for him (well some did)… oh wait, or did we? Who’s being played here? Us or them- or both?

Only the captains will know what deals go on behind closed doors.

All the speculation in the world could not endure an ounce of truth from the lips of a President.

#16 
Written By tangledwebweaver on May 17th, 2004 @ 10:57 pm

Jesus christ. I’m pretty sure there is something in Islamic law about SAWING SOMEONES HEAD OFF, AS WELL. Lawn furniture? You’re REALLY using LAWN FURNITURE to back up your point?! I can go get that EXACT same chair from a HUNDRED dollar stores. Does that mean -I- sawed off Nick Bergs head? Hellll no.

As for your calmness theory. They have guns, video cameras, large scale weapons. I think they can spring for a little tranq juice. Plus, dude had no idea what was going on, and they had guns. WHY THE HELL WOULD HE STRUGGLE? Till they pulled out the saw. Then….he went nuts, as he should. And yes, there was a LOT of blood.

Fat white guys? Where the HELL do you see white guys? They may not be field soldiers, but they weren’t WHITE, fer gods sake.

Prison walls the same color. Dude. Desert. It’s a neutral color so it isn’t bright as hell, and hot as the same during the day. Do some damn research.

And dude. Terroists. Hellooo? You really think they DONT WEAR THIER VESTS AT ALL TIMES? And fyi…those vests do dick agaisnt a piercing weapon.

Seriously, it’s great you wanna be nice to the people we severly fucked up. But in all honesty…the CIA has been doing a fabulous job doing cover-ups for longer than any of us have been alive. I don’t think they will screw up a wee video.

#17 
Written By The Scybermonk on May 17th, 2004 @ 10:59 pm

Alxandro,
I guess I disagree with you on this one (nice debating with you tho) I have a lot of background on the NWO. I used to run a booth at preparedness expos, and have known a lot of Militia and NWO theorist people. (John Trochman, Randy Weaver, Bo Gritz etc.) They were running around 15 years ago talking about Black Helicopters, US concentration camps, UN troops on US soil, and buried their gold coins. My ex still has huge stockpiles of rice and flour from Y2K.

With the exception of the Patriot Act (I’m against) and anti-terrorism measures what have we lost? The conservatives have not passed any legislation on gun rights. We are currently at war with an opponent that has no organized country or face. I do feel we are making some civil right concessions. Americans have sacrificed a lot more in past wars. During the Civil War Lincoln suspended habeas corpus. Every time new style money is minted the nay sayers claim it’s part of a conspiracy (for 100 years.) My ex took a business trip right after 9/11 claiming state borders would be sealed and free travel would cease to exist as we knew it.

Everything NWO they have claimed has not come into fruition and has even gone the opposite direction. We are more polarized from Western Europe and Russia now than since the wall fell.

If the Powers-that-be have a grand design, then the UN would have jumped on board with the whole Iraq thing. (One less country to get into line)
This Iraqi thing would have set the NWO agenda back decades. Why would they blow such a chance?

There are too many powerful butt-heads out there with power-struggle issues to get into line for a NWO thing to work. Have you ever heard any leaders say “So-and-so won’t let me into the NWO!!” Never has any major leader fallen out of favor and leaked out “The Grand Plan.”

With the internet free exchange of ideas is rampant. No loger is there ABC, NBC, and CBS to spoon-feed the masses. There are more independent thinkers out there than ever. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying there aren’t groups of powerful individuals controlling elements of our world.

Globalization is a symptom of our technology based civilization, not the Illumiati.

#18 
Written By Sharon on May 17th, 2004 @ 11:20 pm

if the narrative with berg were videoed at the prison on an earlier date, then the beheaders whould have no choice (since he identified himself in that video) but to behead him in the orange jumpsuit.

his appearance is different in those two separate incidents.

-t-

Posted by: tam at May 17, 2004 07:26 AM

tam: I think you’re right about that. Someone on Liberty Forum* has done a frame-by frame analysis of the first portion. There is no doubt that two cameras were used, one of which is on a tripod throughout, and other one mobile. It would seem that the desynchronised audio and the missing moments, here and there, can be accounted for by the fact that someone with a green cap (the Official movie director?) occasionally appears at the edge of the image in the tripod camera (2:44, etc.) and has to be cut out of the sequences.
Upthread, someone has observed that the audio is poor, not having been shot by a grip.

This suggests that Mr Berg was in Abu Ghraib from April 19 through May 8, 2004, and that the first shots of him sitting on the white plastic Walmart chair were taken with the same camcorders which recorded other events in the infamous prison. This will explain why the rest of the material is not being released: technical analysis of video images of US-sponsored torture and sado-machistic orgies would reveal the entire story. The tape was made to prevent release of those documents.

If you are horrified by the dreadful death of Mr Berg and Suport Our Troops, call your Congressman and Senator and demand that all the material from Abu Ghraib be published.
__________
* http://www.libertyforum.org/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=news_international&Number=1471708&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=21&part=1

#19 
Written By Her on May 17th, 2004 @ 11:35 pm

Jason, Jason, Jason, You sure are upset. What part of ‘dialog’ do you not understand? You have insulted person after person on this forum, by insisting we don’t know the facts.

Well DUH! Go back and read Marc’s introduction. Seems like he didn’t insist he was right on every count. seems like he was inviting us to discuss it…..

Apparently you are sure YOU have ALL of the answers. What gives you the right to believe Bush is lily white and INSIST the rest of us believe that hog wash?

You have not answered the more difficult points people have posted here. Just ridiculed anyone who disagrees with your puppy love of Bush. This is a Forum, not truth or consequences.

How utterly rude to ORDER me not to answer your attack on me. Sorry, I don’t take orders from Bush Toadys. As to intelligence, you have shown a decided lack thereof, so maybe you shouldn’t accuse others of lacking something you seem to have such a short supply of.

Feel free to answer, when you dislodge your foot from your mouth.

#20 
Written By Rebecka on May 17th, 2004 @ 11:41 pm

The orange attire is not a prison jumpsuit. It’s not even close. Look at the color, the sheen, and the drape of the fabric. Besides, do you think our CIA or whomever would be dumb enough to fake this film with all the little “coincidences” in it? A bunch of 12 year olds would do a better fake job than that.

#21 
Written By Bart on May 17th, 2004 @ 11:42 pm

This whole thing is incredibly stupid, but especially the part where Muslims are forbidden to wear gold jewelry. Ever heard of the Gold Souk? Muslims fricken love the stuff!

http://www.ferien.li/dubai-infos/goldsouk-dubai/info2.htm

http://www.bahraingoldcity.com/index1.html

#22 
Written By the anti-kook on May 17th, 2004 @ 11:51 pm

Ignoble: I dont know about that, but I will view it again and try to listen closely.

Though I do know that after the chants of “Allahu Akbar”, you can hear a western voice saying : “Thy will be done”.

Thanks…

#23 
Written By Mahra on May 18th, 2004 @ 12:11 am

Tangle, glad you noticed that I can admit a mistake, quite readily, you see. No coincidences? Then you are saying either that the the military did do it or that whoever did set it up to look like the military did it even though only us few would notice it. Seems like a lot of work to through for the few of us who have noticed.

#24 
Written By Soseraphic on May 18th, 2004 @ 12:17 am

No no, Anti-kook, It is forbidden and considered as a sin for a male muslim to wear gold. (NECKLACE, BRACELET, RING, TOE RING, PIERCING…etc).I am a muslim female from the United Arab Emirates, so i would know.

But I still dont think thats a proof he’s not Al-zarqawi. The only positive theory about him NOT being Al-zarqawi is because he is masked, if he did say he was Al-zarqawi then there is no reason for him to wear some burglar-like mask and look stupid. Have we ever seen Osama bin Laden wear a mask? I dont think so.

#25 
Written By Mahra on May 18th, 2004 @ 12:20 am

Oh man…. You guys are killing me here. I read a lot of these comments, and I had to stop – they are all going around in circles rehashing the same stuff over, and over again, yet people don’t even think about what is being said. The chair is indeed different, they are NOT bulletproof vests, the orange jumpsuit is NOT the same as a prision vest (sleeves, zipper, etc), and yada yada yada.
My point being, that no one here has even REMOTELY entertained the notion that they [Iraqi terrorists] might have “duped” us into believing that we were duped. Thats right! – this is one of the more basic aspects of 4GW (4th Generation Warfare), and no one has even mentioned this. “halfing” your opponents army by turning them against each other is the same as killing half of them. And so far its working – they have used 4GW against us in this whole prision abuse thing, and getting “half” of all Americans to turn against Bush, and the efforts in Iraq. Think about it, “why” would the CIA, or any BushCo people even stage this – it ain’t gonna get ANY more Americans to support Bush, or the war efforts, even a 6th grader would tell you that. Its common knowledge that there is nothing that *anyone* can say/do that would EVER change the mind of a Busher/America hating anti-war type. Clear to me that this is a 4GW tactic, and this 2-mile long string of comments on this subject is pure PROOF of it – devide the enemy, and seed further doubts so that one of the half hands up “halfing” again so that eventually the ENTIRE population of your enemy is no longer your enemy, and all for different reasons. Its a brilliant and effective tactic, and so far, there is no known defence for it and 4GW. And that sucks too.

#26 
Written By Mr Wizzard on May 18th, 2004 @ 12:27 am

I’m assuming no one bothered to read this yet:

I just stumbled on something. As ugly as it might seem you have to go and watch the video again.

1)The tape begins with a shot from one camera from Berg’s left side. Berg is looking at another camera pionted straight on. Notice his right sleve position.

2)Second camera shot is straight on, Notice the right sleeve again. This proves the obvious of editing at least.

3)Now, watch the whole video without sound while Berg is supposedly sitting in front of terrorists reading statement,and KEEP YOUR EYES ON BERG’S LEFT ARM/SHOULDER AREA DOWN TO THE HIP POSITION. WATCH IT CAREFULLY. YOU WILL NOTICE THAT A LOT OF MOVEMENT OF HIS SUIT OCCURS WITHOUT HIM MOVING. THE POSITION OF HIS CREASE IN SUIT DOES A LOT OF MOVING WITHOUT HIM EVER MOVING. ALSO OBSERVE UNDER HIS BUTTOCS. A LOT OF MOVEMENT OCCURS WITHOUT HIM MOVING.

4)ALSO NOTICE THE “BLEEDING OF COLOR” FROM HIS LEFT SHOULDER OVER THE SPEAKERS PANTS. YOU NEVER GET TO SEE THE CONTINUATION OF THE SPEAKERS PANTS DOWN TO HIS FOOT! GIVEN THAT THE LIGHTING IS COMING FROM BERG’S RIGHT, HIS LEFT SHOULD BE VERY SHADOWED AND THE SPEAKERS LEG SHOULD FADE INTO BLACK AND NOT HAVE THE BLEEDING OF COLOR OF BERG’S SUIT!!

5) WATCH THE CREASE ON THE FLOOR DEPARTING FROM BERG’S LEFT HIP/BUTTOCK AREA. IT CHANGES OFTEN.

6) LOOK AT THE LIGHTING OF ALL THE “TERRORISTS.” IT IS VERY HIGH SIDE LIGHTING THAT CASTS SHADOWS OF THE TERRORIST’S HEAD TO THE RIGHT OF THE MOVIE FRAME! tHIS LIGHT IS VERY HIGH AND WOULD NOT BE EFFECIENT ENOUGH TO ILLUMINATE BERG’S FACE AS IT APPEARS IN THE VIDEO!! IF THERE WERE ANOTHER LIGHT TO ILLUMINATE BERG’S FACE THERE WOULD BE FALL OFF LIGHT TO ILLUMINATE THE TERRORIST’S PANTS THAT IS NOT THERE.

THIS IS CLEARLY A SIGN OF SUPERIMPOSED IMAGES THAT DON’T QUITE MATCH!!!

8)THERE IS A 22 MINUTE LAPSE OF TIME FROM THE FIRST TAKE OF BERG’S STRAIGHT ON SHOT IN THE CHAIR TO THE NEXT SHOT OF HIM SITTING IN FRONT OF THE TERRORISTS. THE SAME CAMERA WAS USED FOR THESE SHOTS!!

THIS DOESN’T PROVE THAT BERG WAS/WAS NOT BEHEADED. BUT, THIS PROVES THAT THE VIDEO HAS BEEN EDITED OVER AND OVER AGAIN TO MAKE IT LOOK AS IT APPEARS, WHICH IS CLEARLY NOT THE CASE. THIS DEFINITELY REMINDS ME OF THE OSWALD SHOT THAT APPEARED ON NEWSPAPERS THE DAY AFTER THEY CAUGHT HIM.

I AM A PHOTOGRAPHER AND HAVE MUCH STUDIO EXPERIENCE WITH PORTRAIT LIGHTING AND GROUP LIGHTING.

THE TAPE AS IT APPEARS IS A FAKE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

#27 
Written By Vinnie on May 18th, 2004 @ 12:30 am

I came across a website yesterday (not sure if I saved the link). But, they had a closeup of him when he was sitting in the white chair. (This picture was actually clearer then some I have seen). And, after I spent about 10 minutes looking @ the picture of him in the blue shirt (shaved head), and the picture of him in the chair (w/hair)..They look identical. Although, the pictures that they show from a ‘distance’, makes them look like 2 different people.

I am too much of a chickenshit to watch the video…So, I have not seen it…

#28 
Written By melissa on May 18th, 2004 @ 12:49 am

Anti-kook, lol thats DUBAI, the website, thats where I live. The gold is souk is one of the tourist attractions here. Americans and Brits are everywhere in the gold-souk.

Funny, and we were told Americans are abolutely in love with gold. lol. Wasnt JUST told but had a few experiences. Hey, come of it, who doesnt love gold? And yeah arabic “LADIES” love gold, even some men, but it is STILL considered as against the islamic religion. (Bad, forbidden, sin..!)

#29 
Written By Mahra on May 18th, 2004 @ 12:51 am

I cant evenn think how come a person become so cool just before his execution order? when N.berg was sitting cool i heared he is shouting- what is not possibel. He was shouting but he was still cool. How come it is possible. I have experience to work in vedio editing. I think its a fake video.

#30 
Written By ss on May 18th, 2004 @ 1:02 am

I think that there are many good theories to what really happened. And I mean theories… But to me this is looking more and more like a staged event. 911, flight 800, Oklahoma City, Waco TX, in those and other horror events when they first happened people were shocked. Fear took over and the mind can be easily confused. But in EVERY one of the above listed events, there were factual evidence that was either covered up, or spun into a convenient conspiracy whitewash.

Now what if I told you that I knew of videotape that showed a missile hitting the pentagon? That it was extremely clear, un-edited, and had a time date stamp? Would I be un-American to give it up to the government so it could be destroyed like the FAA supervisor did to the audio transcripts from NY?

No, I’d just sit on the tape, until the time was right. Even the goverment screws up.

#31 
Written By ElizaMoelita on May 18th, 2004 @ 1:08 am

Brother whatsoever is going on we are not practising our islam, if practise islam and respect to other religion, they will come to islam, i am blaming anyone because i am so weak to practise to islam, i tell i thing use to be islam is a one name now islam have a two one is muslim and second is islam if practise according what Allah revealed to us through Prophets, everythig will be goes alright, if the non-muslim know that this remain world because muslims, they will wakes us for every prayers. we have a corect to ourself first and other muslims around the world and stop them to doing the sinning

#32 
Written By Munir Saeed on May 18th, 2004 @ 1:11 am

The reason for the two timestamps is there are two cameras. One rolling with a 2:xx:xx timestamp and one with a 13:xx:xx timestamp. It is obvious from when Nick Berg is giving his name. Camera one shoots from a 45 degree angle and then camera two is shooting him head on. Berg is sitting in the same position and the information flows fluidly. That chair is a Wal-Mart chair here you can buy for 5 bucks. I have no clue where anyone gets the fat white guys argument. There is no reason to believe there would not be an abundance of these chairs in Iraq as well. I’m looking at the 5 assholes and the only one I think is pudgy and pale is the one on the far right as they are standing behind Berg. In our first excursion into Iraq we imprisoned plenty of pudgy pale Iraqi soldiers. No they were not the norm, but they were there. As for the jumpsuit this is probably the best argument you have, but I ask you do you really think it is that difficult for a terror cell to get their hands on one? I can go down to a thrift store and buy one. They want to make the Jew look like a prisoner, it is not that hard to understand. I don’t know what you are seeing that are bullet proof vests. The only thing I see different on terrorist 2,4,5 are what appear to be load-bearing-vests. That definitely would not be unusual for a militant group to have. You are correct that the man claiming to be Zarqawi is not Zarqawi. That is why he is masked. Two schools of thought on this: He knows the name will garner more attention for him, or like pirates of the past the name is passed down so that the next leader can still claim legitimate leadership and a following from those outside his immediate realm(this is the one I go with). I still think there are a few unanswered questions regarding this poor boy’s death but to now try and place the blame on the CIA and little bush is absurd. Compare this video to Daniel Pearl’s beheading and you will see too many similarities to declare this as neocon conspiracy.

#33 
Written By Brick on May 18th, 2004 @ 1:51 am

some good points, I wouldnt put anything past you bent yanks, sooner we get our british troops out the better, I do not want us helping America to fight the jews war.

#34 
Written By John UK on May 18th, 2004 @ 2:01 am

Well, I have tried really hard to read all of these comments, but there are so many. I see that a whole lot of people really want to refuse to believe any conspiracy theory. I too remember how comfortable it was to be able to assume that our government always does the right thing, despite learning of the atrocities of our past when dealing with non-whites and nonchristians (e.g. blacks and slavery, native american mass slaughter, Vietnam, etc.). But those things are supposed to be in the past, according to my early schooling. Now we stand for freedom, democracy, and everything good, right?
You see the only thing that has really changed is that now, ideals are so high that this kind of thing needs to be covered up. Do you think that in WWII, if they found out we were abusing Japanese POW’s, Americans would have cared? Of course not! These days, “patriots” are so caught up in the good vs. evil, benevolent spreaders of freedom rhetoric that they lose sight of the fact that we are at WAR! This kind of thing really does happen during war, so if you don’t like it, perhaps you shouldn’t be so supportive of the war.
All of this being said, there are alot of inconsistencies, some of which the naysayers have offered decent rebuttals to. Many were not really solid points, like the chair or the bulletproof vests, but just because Nick Berg was Jewish does not mean he didn’t have blood flowing through his veins! By the way, I have nothing against Jewish people, that was just a joke. But I cannot see, and have not seen a good counterargument to the lack of blood. Hundreds have talked about the chair. So what, good for you, I hope you feel really smart. What about the blood?

#35 
Written By Nickelless on May 18th, 2004 @ 2:32 am

I guess orange material does not exist
in that region of the world to make jump suites on in the US right?

You must all remember most of American clothes are not made in the US but sweat shops in poor countries.

#36 
Written By sanco on May 18th, 2004 @ 4:36 am

I guess orange material does not exist
in that region of the world to make jump suites only in the US right?

You must all remember most of American clothes are not made in the US but sweat shops in poor countries.

#37 
Written By sanco on May 18th, 2004 @ 4:37 am

WEll, it’s taken me all day to read each and every post in this thread, and the one thing I get from all this “typing” is that there is still two sides warring, the bush-lover-war-is-honorable-sheeple-patriots who name call the rest of us, and the rest of us who think for ourselves.
And, of all the post I’ve read, only one hit it on the head. Satin is alive and well on planet earth, the chief liar who is pulling all the puppet strings on all the politicians on either side of the aisle, and all the religious fanatics, western or middle eastern. However you look at it, the end is indeed neigh. God save his human children from the evil dark spirit that has come over the earth.

–B. Joseph Fekete, Jr. [not afraid to sign my real name!]

#38 
Written By B. Joseph Fekete, Jr. on May 18th, 2004 @ 5:13 am

A synopsis:
1. Terrorist on left is thin and straddling a piece of material that has been used to cover the floor. He/she has on glasses. If he/she is female, could explain the scream which sounds female.
2. Lights are high – could be prison lights.
3. Two cameras are used. One fixed, one mobile.
4. Orange prison outfit used as tape is edited from time he announces identification to beheading.
5. Skin color is light.

Somebody tell me site where I can get sound with video. I listen for a living and will digest and report.

#39 
Written By aintmensa on May 18th, 2004 @ 5:15 am

To aintmensa. Prison lights fixed on a ceiling could not produce the shadows behind the “terrorist” head that way. This I know for a fact. I work with lighting every day for the past 25 years! Not only photographing people but, also still life. I’ve also been working with Photoshop for the past 10 years and know the inherent problems with superimposing images. Who ever made this video I’m just saying that the video is highly elaborated and superimposed just like the Oswald photo that appeared on newspapers and WAS PROVED TO BE A FAKE.

#40 
Written By Vinnie on May 18th, 2004 @ 5:42 am

Well I dont thimk that men from Iraq would be fat and white like americans are. I mean think about it they dont have fastfood like mcdondals over there but they do have it in the usa ??????????????????????????????????????

#41 
Written By harvir on May 18th, 2004 @ 5:49 am

I think the biggest thing that ive seen alot of people missing, is the reason he is in the orange jump suit.

Think about that for a second. Say I’m a terrorist and ive captured someone i plan to later decapitate. I’m not going to walk around IRAQ with my latest punching bag in a orange suit, i mean, your trying NOT to draw attention to yourself.
Plus when was the last terrorist video that you saw masked terrorists in ?

#42 
Written By VG on May 18th, 2004 @ 5:57 am

Yo man my main point is no blood coming from the head man but I think that if cut someons head of man blood would certainly come out man but then again man they must have used specail effects man but then again think about it man do Iraqis have that kind of technologyno man but Americans do man so listen to me you fuckers man

#43 
Written By YO_MAMA on May 18th, 2004 @ 6:00 am

yo man I totally agree with that Harvir, and VG DOOD MAN LIKE 100% MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN

#44 
Written By YO_MAMA on May 18th, 2004 @ 6:05 am

Why does everyone keep saying ‘the CIA can’t be that stupid’? The photos of our military abusing the prisoners proves how stupid our government can be. How can you tell a country ‘abuse and torture of your people is bad’, but for us its ok. Wake up people.

#45 
Written By Ata on May 18th, 2004 @ 6:23 am

Everyone who says “I work with lighting everyday, there’s no way a light would make such a shadow.” or “I have seen people who have had their throats slit and there was blood everywhere…bla BLA BLA” Your points are not valid. You were not in the prison cell taking account of the lights around the prison. Did you take into consideration that video cameras have lights on them? Just because you’ve seen something along the lines of what is in this video doesn’t mean that everything in the video has to be exactly like what you saw.

#46 
Written By Debaser on May 18th, 2004 @ 6:28 am

The molds and dies required to produce those plastic chairs are owned by a major U.S. Company that dominates the housewares market. In order to produce such a chair, the process of injection molding is required using no less than a 400ton press. A search of the Thomas Register will yield the name of the chair manufacturer. It is primarily sold by the U.S. company, Wal-Mart.

Such chairs would most likely NOT be available for purchase in the country of Iraq mostly in part to a zero trade embargo. Be you a skeptic or not, the chair presents a puzzling and bizzare presence.

#47 
Written By Plastic Boy on May 18th, 2004 @ 6:32 am

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